Sunder MC raid

[Mourningblade]

Lol..


I have it

It is Very useful.

I have no idea how I got it to work, but it's working

As stated before, it is REALLY handy when your pvp raiding with, say 8 BWC and theres only 1 priest and a shammy/druid. Healers can cover both groups with heals VERY easily.

Honestly I forget I even have it half the time (until Asshat Rhuac makes me the MainAssist and that MA box pops up)

For non-healers this is nothing more than a background UI with a main assist slot that pops up if one is designated.

[slythetove]

I also blame Rhuac. It needed to be said.

[killets]

Some people like a challenge. I think requiring it is sad... Might as well require stuff like radar, because it is sooo useful in PVP.

1) It's obviously a challenge even without RA.

2) There are other challenges you can undertake, which don't cost the guild the chance to advance in gear.

If "winning" is more important than the members having fun priorities are out of whack. Both can be done.
If "friendships" only exist because you are "winning" then they aren't friendships. They are relationships of convenience and greed.

That's half of what BWC is, despite what you want to think. If BWC was only about existing friendships, the existing core would move from game to game much as it has been recently, and not be trying to expand to raid size. Ever since BWC started on BH, the emphasis was getting the guild raid-ready, accepting guild applications from random people, filling in needed classes. If it only about friends, BWC would be similar to what we're doing on Blackrock, with 1 of my guilds as all RL friends, never being raid ready and only seeing raid content through pugs or alliances. I hate to break it to you, but half of BWC doesn't really know the other half of BWC. You can say it's all about friends, and it's only partially true. For the greater whole, I think it's about getting ahead, whether it's great groups, good leadership or whatever.

I don't think anyone cares if you just say you're fine with not going on raids because you're against the idea that Raid Assist is necessary for the raid. Just don't make it personal, because it's for the raid's success, not some communal gang bang in a dungeon far far away.

[slythetove]

That's half of what BWC is, despite what you want to think.

I hate to break it to you, but half of BWC doesn't really know the other half of BWC. You can say it's all about friends, and it's only partially true. For the greater whole, I think it's about getting ahead, whether it's great groups, good leadership or whatever.

You're not breaking anything to me. However, that doesn't mean it has to be that way. I think the way it is is as you have described, and personally I don't think it's the way BWC should be. So, instead of making it worse, I'm trying to talk about making it better.

It starts with attitude.

Most of the problem is in attitude and entitlement. The rest usually revolves around loot quibbling.

None of those things has to continue to be a cancer in this guild, but we must all be aware, and work to change it if we want it to change.

The first step is to rationally discuss it. I feel for the most part that's what has occurred here.

I see your point of view as "succeeding > anything else".

My point of view is different than that. "Success comes from everything else."

[killets]

bwc has always been about building a winning group.

ever since CoE. there is a core membership who have become good friends over time, but it's still about winning.

why else do you think BWC invites to become raid-ready, merges with other guilds to become more raid-ready, asks people to roll certain classes when coming to BH so we're more raid-ready, and lastly, now telling people to install mods to make us raid-ready...

you don't like it, fine, but when people refuse to conform to the direction the guild wants to go, you get this conflict of interest... it's sad too, i will never understand why anyone would refuse to install a game-sanctioned mod that takes about 15 seconds to install, and only turns itself on during raids at the expense of helping the guild accomplish things it couldn't otherwise.

everyone who has tried it has had no hate for it, yet you preach on your soapbox about how forcing raid attendees to install it is somehow alienating certain members. how about just help the guild out and do it... unless you want to form your own "i don't use raidassist so i won't join bwc raid" clique.

[Xarkon]

ok ok - so this mod seems pretty usful

Only problem is i cant get peoples hp to Come up for me on the little window

I have joined the channel, broadcasted etc etc but i just dont see anyone

other people see me but me no seeye

[Liseyth]

If you type "/rashow all" it'll bring up the different groups or classes depending on settings.

Also, if you go to general options, I think there is an option that allows you to turn on mana/health as well as show actual hitpoints instead of bars.

[slythetove]

everyone who has tried it has had no hate for it, yet you preach on your soapbox about how forcing raid attendees to install it is somehow alienating certain members. how about just help the guild out and do it... unless you want to form your own "i don't use raidassist so i won't join bwc raid" clique.

I have tried repeatedly to explain to you that this is not about a particular mod.

[killets]

not liking how a ui mod is required and not liking how ct_raidassist is required fall into the exact same topic dude..

do i need to draw you a ven diagram?

[barbos]

It's not "necessary"...

If it was "necessary" it would have been included in the game.

It's Venn diagram btw.

You also forgot the larger picture of his, being told how to play the game.

[killets]

it is necessary, and until you guys can do it with it, there's probably zero chance for you to do it without it.

they included in the game a customizable ui with a fully scriptable language so that the community could make the tools they needed to accomplish things in game.

this way the community won't have to wait 6 months to put in needed features. if there was no raid assist, the priority of putting this feature into the UI would have been extremely high. but since raidbar and now raid assist have been out since december, the demand is really low to include it into the native ui, because everyone wanting to raid has installed it already (except for the obvious exceptions).

and no one is telling you how to play the game. you don't have to come to the raid. if you're interested in doing a large group activity, such as raiding and coordinating with 39 other people, it's fair to say that you have to conform to how the other 39 people want to do it. and if raidassist is part of the game plan, then it's your choice to install and join or not.

no one is forcing anything.. you don't need raidassist to be in the guild, only to do the large raids. there was nothing unclear about that.

As always, you must have CT Raid Mod to attend.

it's no different than saying you need to level 60 to attend this raid. the point is that they're not discriminating against people who aren't 60, merely because they aren't 60. it's because it's necessary for the success of the raid. if you want to prove you can do molten core at 52, fine, but just don't expect to do it with this particular raid, because no one wants their time wasted.

[Joshll]

Please don't say "Fuck You" to Eirene ever again. She has given more to this guild than anyone for a very long time. She is worth ten of most of us in terms of what she adds to the guild.

Regardless if you disagree with Killets on this topic, getting all aggressive on a guildy is not cool at all. Eirene sure as hell wasn't disrespectfull on how she posted but you need to break out the f-bomb to communicate? Idiot.

Look, this is simple, if you want to go on a MC raid and the leader requires it, you either get it or don't go. Even if you don't go, you can be a happy member of BWC and we all can still love you. If we start requiring Raid_Assist for raid PVP and you don't want to install it, then don't raid, stick with 5 mans and other fun things we can do together. This guild doesn't soley exist for Epic content and so if you just don't want to do the epic content fine. Your game can still be how you want to play.

Nobody said anything other than that here. We have never made attendance on all events mandatory. So if an event has rules you don't like, don't go. I believe Sly was saying thats how he'd handle it, and thats fine.

But never say "fuck you" to Eirene. She's worth ten of you.

[Kharama]

Sell out

Bought and paid for by the cow in the back.

LOL! ^5 sly

[Kharama]

Please don't say "Fuck You" to Eirene ever again. She has given more to this guild than anyone for a very long time. She is worth ten of most of us in terms of what she adds to the guild.

But never say "fuck you" to Eirene. She's worth ten of you.

LOl thats ammusing thankx for makin me laugh today =)

fyi dont ever tell me what to do again =)

[slythetove]

I believe Sly was saying thats how he'd handle it, and thats fine.

Yes. I just wanted to have a broader discussion about the topic of "mandatory" in general, not about CTRaid mod specifically. It merely brought up a larger idea in my mind and I wanted to talk about it to see where BWC as a guild might be headed.

I'm glad there are folks who understood that.